What’s The Scenario? Sony Playstation 3 VS Microsoft Xbox 360
Today I was going through comment sections reading the madness after the NPD results were dropped. Once again people were saying that the Xbox 360 is ONLY in the lead because it had a 1yr lead. They said that the PS3 would be destroying the 360 right now if they launched together. So to retort, I started thinking about the possibilities Microsoft had to be in the lead 4yrs later if they launched along side of the PS3 and Wii.
I did a little research using the data that we already had and with the worldwide totals for year 4 on the Xbox 360, I had 31.5 million. That means by year 4, using the data we have, Sony would be ahead of the 360 right now by 4.45 million. I wouldn’t call that destroying, I would call that close. There are so many other factors involved with the 360 launching a year later you can’t assume anything. Let’s look at some scenarios.
Scenario 1: Launch Titles
If the Xbox 360 launched a year later, Gears Of War would have been a launch title. Gears Of War is one of the top selling 360 franchises available. It’s also one of the top selling console games this generation. If you just look at launch titles in November 2006, I think Microsoft would have not only had many more games available than Sony, but they would have had triple A titles drawing fence sitters to the Xbox.
Scenario 2: HD-DVD Built In
HD-DVD was launched in March of 2006, 4 months AFTER the Xbox 360 launched. Because the tech was newer than the Xbox 360, Microsoft couldn’t include it in the console and had to opt for an add-on which added cost to the system. Blu-Ray was launched 3 months after HD-DVD and 5 months prior to the Playstation 3. Had Microsoft launched a year later, it would have had HD-DVD as part of the system. This would mean more HD-DVD disc sales, uncompressed audio and better textures for games. This also would have meant no multi-disc games…for the most part. There are other ramifications with this scenario. Judging by my calculations, Playstation 3 and Xbox 360 sales would have been neck and neck had they launched together, with Playstation 3 pulling ahead late in the 3rd year. So with neck and neck sales and Microsoft probably still leading in the US, would Blu-Ray have still won the format war? What made Warner Bros. choose Blu-Ray? Was it money or market share? Every PS3 that was sold meant one more Blu-Ray player in homes. Had that situation been the same with HD-DVD, maybe Warner would have went with HD-DVD. We’ll never know will we?
Scenario 3: Better Hardware
Microsoft screwed up with the 360. The QA on the hardware sucked and they lost BILLIONS of dollars trying to appease customers with warranty repairs. Not only that, but many customers lost faith in Microsoft and bought Playstation 3 consoles instead. Surprisingly, Microsoft still weathered the storm and was able to hold on to their lead and sell millions of consoles. This is unprecedented. So what if Microsoft had an extra year to work out the kinks of the Xbox 360? What if in that whole year, they caught the problem and fixed it before the system launched? Well, had this happened, they would have retained more customers. The Xbox 360 wouldn’t be known as the worst console hardware ever made. Faith would have been sustained, customer loyalty would have been retained. I can’t tell you how many people stopped supporting the Xbox 360 because of hardware issues, but if the hardware issues weren’t there, Microsoft’s retention rate would be much higher.
Scenario 4: Pricing
If Microsoft had launched a year later, they wouldn’t have had the same price advantage. With HD-DVD included, we probably would have seen a $500 Xbox 360. Some people will tell you that the only reason Microsoft is in the lead is because of price. Maybe if the price was higher, that would have hindered many sales of the Xbox 360. Price drops would have been more competitive. You’d see Microsoft and Sony dropping the prices of their consoles during the same fiscal year.
We’ve all argued this on the Warzone before, but I just have to put some logic to it. You can’t assume that Microsoft is in the lead solely because of the 1yr lead. The Sega Dreamcast was out a year before the PS2 and that didn’t stop Sony from gaining more market share than Sega. It was so bad and so fast, that Sega left the hardware business because they couldn’t compete with Sony and Nintendo financially. Now apply that logic today. Why didn’t Sony pass Microsoft like they did with Sega when they had a 1yr lead? Also, if Sony could have overtaken Microsoft’s market share if they launched together, how come they haven’t overtaken Nintendo’s market share yet? The Wii and PS3 were launched the same week and Nintendo is now the market leader after passing Microsoft. If you are going to use silly logic, apply it to everything.
What kind of scenarios do you have? Do you think Sony would have steamrolled Microsoft if they launched together? See you in the comments section!
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DA_SHREDDER
I hate this subject, cause it seems that no matter what your answer is someone has to disagree. To me Sony is ahead of its time, and everyone has yet to figure it out. (flame shield on)
KingTavy
I agree with this guy. Dead Argument that only causes you to look like a xbot. Let fanboys spit flamebait just as people allow the homeless to sleep on benches outside and put it in your its not my problem section
Daytripper
.
“dead argument that only causes you to look like a xbot”
you really do need to work on the trolling skills, that was very poor.
KingTavy
I sir am no troll and have nothing against Torrence. Everytime he brings it up I tell him its a dead argument. He doesn’t like when fanboys call him an xbot, but articles like these dont help the accusation. I don’t believe he should do these because either way someone will disagree with him. I don’t think Tor is an Xbot, and you shouldn’t mindlessly attack someone who isn’t trolling what is this N4G?
UsCoMmAnDeR
Pricing in my mind was really a hge deciding factor for many ppl including myself. Everyone knows how much I love Sony, but I was pissed and had the attitude that $600 for a game machine was insane. I fought internal battles with myself for over a year and finally gave in. I remember playing socom with a bunch of my buddies and alot of them were really amped when they heard about the 360(before launch). I have lost alot of clan mates who went from ps2 to 360. The year advantage and the massive price difference left sony in a black hole. The only ppl who really bought the system on launch are the ppl who buy a product regardless of price. Features only go so far because majority of the public is uninformed about the difference of ps3 v 360. All they know is that there friend has 1 and they want 1.
PS. Excellent Article Tor. I always enjoying reading your editorials
Cueil
isn’t that why the shitty PS2 had over 75 percent market share… friend has it so I get one to. Everyone knows that the PS2 was garbage next to the GC and Xbox 1 yet it dominated like it didn’t even have compition.
UsCoMmAnDeR
I dont know where u get off saying the PS2 was shiityy and garbage. They still have the largest and best library of any console. Your gamer card has been revoked.
BankaiKidd
to the articles question. If both consoles started off as they are now ( games, price and all ) i believe sony would be on top. not saying the 360 would be steamrolled but i believe sony’s fan base that shifted towards the 360 would have picked up a ps3 instead and then later picked up a 360.
rubarb23
You make good points torrence.
I just think this ’1 year head start’ opinion ps3 fanboys are using is complete garbage.
I remember seeing alot of shit on message boards by ps3 fanboys saying that they were going to skip the 360 and wait for the ps3. As far as sony was concerned, the whole ps2 user base was going to pick up a ps3 no questions asked. But that didn’t happen.
I think sony shot themselves in the foot with their original $600.00 price tag, the same way ms shot themselves in the foot with their faulty hardware.
I understand ms’s reason for releasing the 360 first and it has paid off to some extent, but still…, I wish ms would have taken the extra year to make sure they were releasing reliable hardware.
now if both consoles released at the same time, I honestly think ms would have pulled ahead first (going by their launch titles), but I think sony would have would caught up to them within a year and surpassed them…although not by much.
At the end of the day, I seriously can’t believe this console generation. It’s being run by fucking kids screaming at each other ‘we got the bigger dick’ and the fucking games ‘journalist’ out there feeding this bullshit.
Can someone tell me, where in the name of the queen of england, did fucking enjoying your shit and let it be that, go to?
I can’t imagine a world where there is no 360 or ps3 or wii, why would someone want one or the other console to die?
Just play the game bitches.
Sorry about my little rant at the end there.
Romudeth
I think price is the reason that the 360 is ahead of the PS3 and not the one year lead. People wanted a PS3 but where unwilling or unable to pay the hefty $600 price tag. Now that the PS3 is $300 dollars it has quickly started catching up to the 360. There is now only a 4.5 million unit gap between the systems. If the PS3 was $300 at launch even coming out a year after the 360 I think it would have sold as many if not more systems than the 360 at this point.
As far as why the PS3 is not ahead of the Wii, well that one is simple; they cater to different audiences. The PS3 is geared towards the hardcore gamer while the Wii is geared toward the casual gamer. They are selling to two completely different sets of gamers so comparing the systems doesn’t make sense.
Price is the reason the 360 is ahead of the PS3 and not the one year lead.
BLAACKSTARR6
Honestly this whole entire article is flamebait. I’m not saying you typed this up to intentionally start a fanboy whine fest, but you know better. The whole what if thing is pointless. How about we talk about reality, where all the main consoles sold like crap last month?
mboojigga
Then I expect YOU to call out everyone including HipHopGamer on “WHAT IF” scenarios he does each week. How come this wasn’t your response to the Move and Alan Wake shit if you don’t like what if scenarios????
Torrence Davis
it wasn’t meant to be flamebait, just a conversation piece for bitbag fans. apparently, someone hungry for N4G status posted it there.
Codey47
Scenario 2: HD-DVD Built In
Tbh I knew Microsoft wasn’t wholeheartedly supporting HD-DVD format since they released an elite sku in 2007 with only HDMI 1.2.
People in the know, know that HD-DVD required the format to have mandatory support of the new high definition audio codecs.
Which would have required HDMI 1.3 or above, seeing though MS was a major “supporter”.. Microsoft knew that the format would be phased out.
There’s nothing stopping MS to this day.. from continuing to adopt a HD-DVD drive natively, in their sku’s. As we already know HD-DVD or Blu Ray’s storage capacity isn’t just for films.
All the major film companies, at first were showing favour for HD-DVD. And it looked like the format war was over and a victory for HD-DVD.
mboojigga
Microsoft admitted that the only reason they supported HD-DVD was to extend the format war while they made it clear they were focused on digital content. MS knew what they were doing at the time. Sony focused on downloadable content only AFTER the war was over.
Codey47
They never officially admitted a thing.
Why would they do that? It would equate to lost sales on their HDDVD add on.
It was the “insider’s” within the industry that exposed what microsoft was up to
http://crave.cnet.co.uk/homecinema/0,39029447,49294617,00.htm
Kingslayer
This article is an article that is more close to reality than not. Even with it’s speculation.
Take for instance the 1yr lead. Many people, including Sony felt that the PS3 was so superior in it’s marketing leadership that this generation was Sony’s to lose. Analysts predicted the PS3 to be leading this generation with Nintendo dead last. The system that really hurt the PS3 was not the Xbox 360, but the Wii. The success of the Wii took away many sales from both systems. The one year head start for the Xbox 360 actually saved it from being blown out the water by the Wii also.
The problem with PS3 owners is that they don’t want to give Nintendo and Microsoft credit for having their shit together. While Sony did not. That’s the real reason this generation is the way it is. Tor your theory on HD-DVD is spot on, because early adoption of these new formats where up in the air. Blu-Ray in the PS3 was a trojan horse. A gamble that Sony felt since working with DVD could do so again.
As for software…Could you imagine just for a second never seeing Gears of War till both the PS3 and Xbox 360 were on the shelves. The build up and anticipation at E3, plus more polish for the other titles. Let’s say the Xbox 360 was more reliable. I think Microsoft would have taken a hit on price just to make sure they came in more competitive than the PS3. That warranty money would have gone straight to that. Microsoft has been aggressive this whole generation from the start. So any edge would have been taken like it already has. Sony PS3 fans keep forgetting that the Dreamcast also had a year head start on the PS2. It didn’t matter. So there’s more to it than one year start.
Again like you said, the amount of speculation can go on, but gamers need to stop with the 1yr lead, and look at the whole landscape of gaming this generation.
DA_SHREDDER
“As for software…Could you imagine just for a second never seeing Gears of War till both the PS3 and Xbox 360 were on the shelves”
Um Ya dude, Ive played the shit out of Gears 1 and 2 and I thought both games sucked monkey balls. Also, the ps2 still has some of the best games ever created to this day. Some of the best games ever created are on the playstation format. I think that most of you guys on these blogs and gaming sites just started gaming in the past decade. So many great games from the past, and yet the only games you xbox guys talk about is COD, Gears, and Halo. Give me a freakin break, ive played better games on the regular NES.
Man_Of_The_Year
“Um Ya dude, Ive played the shit out of Gears 1 and 2 and I thought both games sucked monkey balls.”
- Couldn’t have sucked that much if you played the “SHIT” out of “GEARS 1 AND Gears 2″.
LOL great quote. I love some of the intellect on this site.
DA_SHREDDER
Thanx for noticing how I clearly tried to like the game. Honestly I did. I even bought the map packs, including that ridiculous one they announced on gametrailers vga’s. I guess its cause alot of my friends tried to like it too, but we all agreed the game has some good things, but alot of awful things to much to care ever again.
UsCoMmAnDeR
Yeah its possible to play a shitty game if your are playing friends. Hell ive logged over 120hrs on Socom Confrontation. The only reason I play is because I used to like the series and alot of my friends play it.
HatedGreatnesss
HAHAHA @ Man_Of_The_Year exposing the fanboys. This is comedy!
OOG
get off the high horse… all companies are greedy.. facts of life…. they are all in it to make money
*ah FACK damn comment didnt go under the right person…. ah well…. lol
Daytripper
how dare you OOG, dont you realise they love and cherish us? Even a homeless xbot or ps3 looney can go up to a exectuive and will get at least a couple of bucks for something to eat, they care that much!
Death2494
Sales only matter to me for reasons other than bragging rights. Developers looks at these numbers and decides on which console will be their lead platform in a multiplatform game. They weigh their options about going exclusive with just one console also. But this generation is a little different since most of the high quality games are coming from Sony’s internal studios. If i keep getting games like this then Sony can stay in last place for all I care.
Oh P.S. Microsoft were not taking the systems back 6 months after it launched. RROD’s occured alot and the only thing people could do at was trade in the broken one to take money off buying another one. I worked for Gamestop at this time. Since there were no alternatives, people sucked it up and purchased another one, myself included.
palaeomerus
Once every console has around 20 million units out there you can bet that most third party exclusives will start to disappear. Once you have a pool of 20 million buyers to market to a port becomes financially feasible and desirable.
All three consoles merit developer attention this time around. Nobody is going to get cut off by EA or anything like that at this point. Also it looks like the market in general is more interested in a refresh than a successor so we might see another couple of years or more without a new console being announced. Updates seem quite likely though.
palaeomerus
Ms had a one year warranty on the 360 originally.
They later ‘retroactively’ extended it to three years for RROD and E74. That’s how I got my 2007 360 fixed)actually replaced) for free in 2009 when their online site said that I was out of warranty. Well, actually I payed UPS $12 to pack the thing up. They paid the shipping.
I know some guys who do electronic repairs and most of them seem to think that the problem is using lead free or low-lead solder in high heat devices which leads to brittle joints that don’t last under frequent use. Basically to use cold solder the original 360 unit needed to be the size as a mid size PC case with (fans and enough space to dissipate heat )to be reliable. People wouldn’t be likely to to buy that and the engineers did not convince marketing of the seriousness of the issue so there was a problem. MS was trying to brand the 360 as being some sort of hip Wired-magazine inspired lifestyle doohicky that had iPod like mojo so a pc-esque brick was incompatible with that message.
palaeomerus
I think if MS had made 360 with free online play, a built in HDD, and with better quality for $300 they’d be the Wii right now. I could be wrong. I bought my 360(a Pro) in 2007 for $350 when the model with HDMI slot came out. I bought it mainly to play Halo3. It died in summer of 2009 and MS replaced it. I bought a 120GB HDD from Circuit City when they were going broke for $85. I don’t have XBOXLIVE-GOLD so I don’t play online on my machine. I get most games for my 360 because I know more people with a 360 and that lets me borrow and lend games. I typically buy a lot of cheap used games after they’ve been out for a while. I currently have 107 360 games including xbox-live arcade and xbox-indie downloadable games.
I bought my PS3 in the early summer of 2008. It was $400 for the 40GB(the one with no BC and a sixaxis) but it came with a $100 giftcard at Walmart so I used that to buy an extra Dualshock 3 controller and Metal Gear Solid 4. I also got $100 which I used to buy a bundle of ‘Earth’ and ‘Biography of the Earth’ on blu-ray. Mostly I just get exclusives on the PS3 and occasionally games that have extra features, look better, or just happened to be on sale on the PS3. I have 39 PS3 games including PSN games that I downloaded.
I play both of these on a $150 Hanspree 1080P PC monitor with hilariously cheap HDMI cables that are like 4 feet long.
I bought my Wii in 2009 for $250 and so far only have a few games for it. I bought Super Mario Galaxy, Wario Land Shake it, New Super Mario Bro.s Wii, Zak and Wiki, Endless Ocean, VC-Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars, VC-Paper Mario, Metroid Prime Trilogy, Super Monkey Ball Bannana Blitz, Super Paper Mario, and Super Smash Brothers Brawl (which I sold to get God of War III), Boom Blox Bash Party, De Blob, Zelda Twilight Princess, Link Crossbow Training, Sam and Max: Season 1, Force Unleashed, and Wii sports. (That’s 17 games currently). I mostly buy Nintendo platformer/adventure stuff on the the Wii or cheap stuff that I see in dollar stores for $15 (like Force Unleashed).
So far the 360 has been my favorite, but then I buy MOST of my games for it, and most of my favorite games have turned out to be big anticipated multiplatform titles like Dead Space or Resident Evil 5.
UsCoMmAnDeR
Why do ppl think MS would bundle an HD-dvd from the get go. This is a company notorious for selling you add-ons. As for the free online I doubt it because XBOX 1 had a pay to pay.
Also neither console will catch the WII. The main reason why is that console sells to both gamers and soccer moms. If you were to ask me what is the biggest suprise this gen I would easily say the WII. Sure sony being last in sales is weird and MS in front of sony is also odd, but the wii blows my mind. Its almost amazing how little that console offers but is spanking the shit out of its competition.
palaeomerus
I said 360 should have come with an HDD (a hard disk drive) standard for $300, not an HDDVD. And they put one as standard in the xbox so expecting them to do it for the 360 makes sense for a consumer looking to jump from Xbox to 360. Instead $300 bought them an Arcade unit that had no HDD and the HDD was ridiculously priced at $100 initially. For me, $400 is too much to start a console.
The original Xbox had free online until 2005. It built up slowly from rather primitive roots. All you needed was ethernet to a router. Live-Silver and Live-Gold did not exist until 360 came out.
The only real Xbox add-on I remember buying was the DVD player unlock key and remote.
UsCoMmAnDeR
My fault for misreading.
palaeomerus
I don’t care much about HDVD. Hell I don’t even care about Blu-Ray much.
devil22
oh buddy
tor i expect better then this of you. you know better let ppl think whatever you are not going to change there minds.
i dont care whos in the lead i care about the games not the box its in.
HatedGreatnesss
This is the best comment to this whole article. Tor, I hope you read this!
SixAmpFuze
If ps3 and xbox released in the same year would we have a slim right now? Was the slim released sooner than it should have been? Would the ps3 be at $4-500 instead of $3-400?. We just don’t know. But one thing we do know is that the ps3 is selling very very well in all countries so ms needs to do something if they want to maintain their 4kk lead.
hysonmb
The whole argument, if MS didn’t launch first, is pointless. I say this because they did launch first and there is no changing that.
I realize this is a “what if” scenario, but, the argument can be made in either direction.
What if Sony launched first? The Blu-Ray drive wouldn’t have been available. They would have been exposed (more negatively) for the rendered video they claimed to be gameplay at E3… remember Killzone 2. They would have been highlighted for the hardware issues they had. There’s more but I’m sure you get the point by now.
The true question today as I see it is what either can do to topple the other commandingly. Sony has upset quite a few people with broken promises. Think about when they laughed at MS for not fully supporting the orignal Xbox library. Now, I can still throw NFL 2K5 in my 360 if I feel the need for a throwback but, that massive PS2 library my buddy has is useless because he got a PS3 slim.
They said they fully supported using the Other OS feature. We all see now how that worked out, lawsuits.
Microsoft is not the golden child in all of this with the high hardware failure rates and still charging to use XBL. They do, however have the benefit of not taking away anything that 360 owners have come to enjoy with the exception of support for the original Xbox titles on Live which isn’t really a 360 thing at all.
So, the point is that any hypothetical situation can be spun to make either side of the discussion right therefore negating the need for the discussion. When based in reality, the fact is MS launched first and Sony has yet to catch up. They may one day, they may not, does it really matter to the consumer other than to say that they have the top selling console at this point? No… neither company is going to quit now so enjoy the competition as it forces them to do more innovative things to draw us to them, and we are the winners no matter who you support.
UsCoMmAnDeR
Welcome to 2010
They would have been exposed (more negatively) for the rendered video they claimed to be gameplay at E3… remember Killzone 2.
Killzone 2 easily matched the quality of that traier. Maybe if you would have played the game you would have known that.
SixAmpFuze
What I think upsets most fannies is that the xbox is a real challenger to the ps3 when alot of people thought it would be nothing.
Daytripper
you seem to be a normal person sixampfuze, and i hope you would agree with that when it comes to buying a system, who honestly should give a flying fuck what someone on the internet who has no importance or relevance to your life buys? it shouldnt matter, it only matters to the money men in the business side of things.
i never thought the 360 was nothing, i do remember the whole “xbox 1.5″ saga during e3 2005 and when the system launched, i still bought it and i still bought the ps3 when that got abuse. never take any notice to people, just think for yourself when it all comes down to it. its your money.
HatedGreatnesss
I agree 100% Sadly, “gamers” now don’t want to do that. They want to attack others for not thinking like them. They want to make up this whole fake “console war” and be fanboys while defending pieces of plastic and metal like religious idols. It is sad really. I warned Tor this would happen when he posted this article. His intentions were noble, but gamers today are not.
UsCoMmAnDeR
Good point sixamp. MS definately stepped up their game this gen as opposed to last. The only good that can come out of this is that Sony hopefully learned name doesnt always sell a product.
DA_SHREDDER
I think Microsoft will have some sort of chance at redemption if they stopped with their smoke and mirror approach, sat down, and started making first and second party games. I mean, you guys all talk about how microsoft does this and that,, what about the games? Where is my conker HD? What about KOTOR? I remember Morrowind on the regular xbox was phenomenal.
Games back in the day used to be so much freakin fun. Shame on Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo for turning gaming into a popularity contest. Things would be so much better if they all just shut up and made us games instead of trying to slit each others throat.
Daytripper
well said da_shredder, i totally agree with you
SixAmpFuze
In the end does it really matter? The xbox is what 4-5 years old it sold 40kk the ps3 is 4years old it sold 36 kk both systems are popular , both systems have games, both systems have something for everyone I don’t understand why do the sales matter so much to some people. Why aren’t hardcore wii fans yelling haha we sold 50-60kk? We all know we will have a ps4 and an xbox3 so why bicker? Sales can be what if’ed to death. What if there was no rrod what if sony’s bluray laser manufacturing didn’t fuck up and push the system back a year only reason xbox sold so much was because of rebuys only reason ps3 sold so well was becausepeople wanted the most capable bluray player at the time yada yada yada. It’s boring.
Reading tors article I didn’t get a flamebait feeling so I don’t know why when sales are discussed commenters turn into Cujo fanboys.
I hae both ps3 and xbox and I game 95% on my xbox for personal reason I like live, the controller and my friends are there. But I’m not wearing a hat that says my xbox mouth fucks the ps3s mother.
I dunno ps3 will overtake the xbox in sales most likely by mid 2011. But at that point will it really matter? Will will have new console ready to come out a year after that. So who wins console fanboys or the manufacturer who make zombies out of simple minded people and feed their head with wishwash just like all those retard conservatives who watch glenn beck, and rush limbaugh . Dummies I tell u dummies!!
“Sword of Omens, give me sight beyond sight!”
UsCoMmAnDeR
Why aren’t hardcore wii fans yelling haha we sold 50-60kk?
they dont have internet. lol
All in all I agree with all your points.
palaeomerus
Well the PS2 fans were fairly quiet last gen. I guess having your consoleway up in front in the sales race is kind of peaceful and relaxing or something.
UsCoMmAnDeR
Last gen internet was no near a popular and used as often as today.
CHOZINWON
Only fanboys care about who is leading in sales and why or why not. Torrence, I’m shocked that you went through all of this to disprove PS3 fanboys.
Torrence Davis
Where did I mention fanboys in the article? This took 30min of my time to write.
CHOZINWON
“Today I was going through comment sections reading the madness after the NPD results were dropped. Once again people were saying that the Xbox 360 is ONLY in the lead because it had a 1yr lead. They said that the PS3 would be destroying the 360 right now if they launched together.”
By the words “people” and “they” I’m pretty sure you were referring to PS3 fanboys. Who else would say those things, certainly not Xbox fanboys.
Torrence Davis
But you really don’t know WHO I was referring to. You are assuming.
Man_Of_The_Year
“This took 30min of my time to write.”
- How many minutes did it take you to do the “little research using the data that we already had and with the worldwide totals for year 4″?
I hope a lot more than just 30 minutes since you were covering 4 years worth of stats.
Torrence Davis
I wrote this to spark conversation, not to flamebait or pick on any fanboys. It’s a damn shame that I can’t even write an editorial without people thinking there’s some hidden agenda.
CHOZINWON
Come on Torrence, you had to know that this would only bring out the most rabid fanboys of both sides. This is the same sort of speculation and hypothetical stuff that HHG does to incite the fanboys.
Torrence Davis
It may be speculation but it’s speculation with logic behind it. You read it didn’t you? It sparked your interest. Are you angry?
CHOZINWON
Angry? At what? I didn’t enjoy Splinter Cell: Conviction any more knowing that the Xbox is leading in HD sales and I didn’t enjoy God of War III any less knowing that the PS3 is losing in HD sales. Only fanboys do that. All I’m saying is this is flame bait and I’m surprised you did this. Now some idiot is going to write a “why the Xbox is leading the PS3 due to the 1 year head start” article after reading this.
Man_Of_The_Year
@CHOZINWON
“This is the same sort of speculation and hypothetical stuff that HHG does to incite the fanboys.”
- No it is not. Like Torrence said “it’s speculation with logic”. Torrence backs up his arguments with rational speculations. These are valid speculations. Nothing was made up, and nothing was proclaimed as fact or proof.
CHOZINWON you clearly have a lack of comprehension if you think this written piece is similar to HHG’s vidicles.
CHOZINWON
@MOTY
You say “noting was made up” in a completely speculated and hypothetical article but you say I have a “lack of comprehension”?
Man_Of_The_Year
Apparently you do. Again like Tor and myself said, it’s LOGICAL speculation, using rational information located on the internet. The speculation used in Tor’s article came form DOCUMENTED PROOF thus a rational, educated assumption could be made. HHG doesn’t use RESEARCH and only makes up his own opinion and tries to present it as PROOF. ie. his latest vidicle stating that Alan Wake is on the wrong console with PROOF.
Your comment just reinforces my comment that you lack the sense of comprehension. You are an irrational thinker and can’t see the difference between this article and it’s researched speculation to HHG’s non-researched speculation. Right at the beginning of the second paragraph, |Tor advises that he did the research with information that he already had and is accessible to anyone with an internet connection.
SixAmpFuze
@da shredder Everyone I know who had a 360 rrod never bought another system because they were fixed for free. Now I know 6 people who had ps3′s die and they had to pay $150 and didn’t get anything for their “emotion distress”
For instance my 25 yr old bro had a 360 rrod on him and it took a total of 2 weeks to get it “fixed”, 5 mo later it rrod again and ms “fixed” it and gave him a yr of live free. 3rd time it rrod but was his fault and ms fixed it and they gave him 2 ms games for free and a brand new system. His ps3 ylod and they gave him a choice to fix it for $150 or buy a new one at $400 at the time and it took 5 or 6 weeks to get it back and he has a problem with the drive and then Sony had to fix that. He bought a new ps3 slim. So rebuys happen on both sides . He’ll I went through 4 ps2′s because of their shitty DVD drives. Maybe the ps2 sales figure really should be at 70kk and let’s knock off 30kk for rebuys.
Sony and ms fucked up this gens hardware hopefully next gen these companies will be smarter.
As for paying for the exclusives both sides fo it. Ms buys the games and Sony buys the developers so who’s at fault. Both companies are doing what they want. Ms paid to get hta, ff13, and others on their system. Sony bought naughtydog,media molicule,zipper,and many other to make the games. And keep them on a Sony platform . Personally buying a developer seems better in the long run IMHO but sometimes these devs release dud after dud and they shutdown so spending kk’s on ips rather than 100kk’s on devs works for ms. I dunno
The xbox has it’s 1,2 party games And ps3 has theirs and more of them but. I’ve never felt like the xbox didn’t have anything to look forward to.
” it’s a multiplatform machine with cross game chat ”
so is the ps3 – the cross game chat . You can’t say that about the wii.
UsCoMmAnDeR
Sony and ms fucked up this gens hardware hopefully next gen these companies will be smarter.
Consoles break. Ever generation consoles have had problem so I dont expect any changes in the future. Also please dont have the audacity to put sony in the same catergorie and ms and their faulty hardware. Sony is well with the industry failure standard, where MS is setting records.
HatedGreatnesss
Uhhh, go look up PS2 errors and check back with me on that one.
Bottom line, quality standards for BOTH sony and microsoft were subpar.
Why is Nintendo the only console to make a durable console consistently?
SixAmpFuze
Sir the ps1 and ps2 were built just as shitty as the xbox360.fuck industry standards back th in the ps1 and ps2 early days this shit wasn’t in everyones face like it was this gen. The ps2 had super shitty DVD drives. I remember being told how to work around the problem by adjusting a white gear in the ps2 and the ps1 we had to play upside down or sideways
Kingslayer
@SixampFuze Bless you for bringing up those facts on RROD, and faulty system hardware that the PS2 had. @Dashreder is trying way to hard to rewrite history to make it seem like Microsoft is the only company that has had hardware issues. Not once in his comments has he stated that Microsoft has in place a warranty system that has bared the brunt of the technical problems Xbox 360 has experienced. He also never points out that Sony charges you $150 dollars to get your PS3 fixed or your alternative is to literally buy a new PS3. All of the accusations he’s claiming are relevant to the Xbox 360 success in fact can be laid to bare on the PS3 if you wanted to make that argument.
The problem with people like @Dashredder is they try to fuel a fire based on their own emotions, and not the facts. He omits facts on both the PS3 and Xbox 360 to make an attack on Torrence for an editorial. Which by it’s nature is an opinion peace. So who is he to tell Torrence what he can, and can’t do?
Anyway the point is people like him only want
to skew things they don’t want to have an honest debate, and look at things in totality. Instead perpetuate lies. I know many people like your brother @Sixampfuse who have those same issues. So that other guy can write lies here, but people know better.
CHOZINWON
The disc drive broke on my Xbox and that 3 year RROD warranty did not cover it and I had to pay for it. Just FYI. That 3 year warranty only covers RROD and E74. After 3 years you will have to buy another one. People act like that warranty is forever and it covers everything.
Man_Of_The_Year
What you are talking about is completely different than an RROD problem. A drive breaking happens with the PS3 as well. And to get that fixed, it cost you $150. Those types of things happen. Don’t make is sound like the 3-4% of PS3 issues were just made up numbers. Obviously that 3-4% of PS3 hardware issues were mainly things such as faulty drives.
MS’s main issues, which is what Tor is focusing on, is the RROD since it was the most common issue.
CHOZINWON
All I’m saying is that I’ve had to pay for both. My PS3 got the YLOD and my Xbox disc drive broke and I had to pay for both. I also got 3 RRODs as well but those were covered under the warranty.
Man_Of_The_Year
“The disc drive broke on my Xbox and that 3 year RROD warranty did not cover it and I had to pay for it. Just FY”
- Your quote implied differently. You only focused on MS and chose to leave out that Sony does the same thing. Since both have and can suffer from the same issues, in this case the drives, then it’s senseless to bring up only MS’s, let alone either MS or Sony.
DA_SHREDDER
Who are you again?
palaeomerus
Batman Muther#@#$er ?
HatedGreatnesss
ROTFL!!!
HatedGreatnesss
@Kingslayer
Thank you sir, for a quality comment
Man_Of_The_Year
Bottom line here is that I don’t care what the outcome would have been. It is what it is right now. And right now both companies are doing very well in market share. And if you were smart, you would have grabbed some MS and SONY stocks last year when their stocks were extremely low. If you act now, Sony’s stocks have taken a bit of a dip, grab some ASAP and watch it climb in time. Buy now. You won’t regret it in 15 years.
You can thank me then.
palaeomerus
Sony once accidently released TWO DIFFERENT MP3 Players on the market at the same time using two different music services because the VAIO people weren’t talking to the old half forgotten Walkman people.
They launched the PS3 at $600 and have since dropped major features to make the platform cheaper and safer.
They crashed the Spider-Man movie franchise.
They made a bunch of exploding notebook batteries.
They made a PSP that won’t play UMD’s that costs a lot more than a PSP that WILL play UMD’s.
They had music CD’s what secretly installed a root kit on Windows PC’s when you merely played them in your CD-ROM drive and that rootkit compromised PC security because you MIGHT be ripping a Sony Music CD.
Cell appears to have been abandoned as the next thing in computer chips. EVEN scientists and video processing seem to be headed towards a GPU like architecture for their number crunching needs and CPU makers are sticking to symmetrical multiprocessing. Cell powered TV’s and cable boxes seem to have not arrived as predicted.
Now, I’m not saying that all is bad news for Sony.
They got Blu-ray launched as the de facto high density data optical format and HD media format. It’s growing a little more slowly than expected due partly to inflated movie prices, broadband and huge cheap hard drives, but overall it’s out of danger and taking ground in big box store movie aisles.
Sony HAVE recaptured a lot of ground in their console war with Microsoft which IS very impressive (and MS seems to just be LETTING them catch up while trying to build their NATAL thing as the game changer. That doesn’t seem wise to me, but I’m just some jerk on a message board and am not in MS’s head. They MIGHT be happy with 40 million units in five years as being what’s worth fighting for this gen.)
Sony have more or less saved their bleeding MMO division (Wow hit Everquest pretty hard) with a newer “free to play” casual friendly MMO design that makes money by selling extras in micro-transactions Korean MMO style.
Sony seem to have unified and streamlined their corporate structure somewhat enough that it doesn’t compete against itself.
Sony like any company is a mixed bag. Investing in them just because you like what’s going on with the PS3 may not be such a great idea. MS might also be shaky at times. Vista did not work out well for them. They had to remove a major feature of Office for patent infringement. Nintendo took a horrible risk with the Wii and DS and thanfully both payed of big time.
DA_SHREDDER
Now your a professional investor? We are talkinga bout the difference between the ps3 and 360. There is no need to bring down the company as a whole. We all know they are nothing but greedy pieces of shit. Why do we have to fight about that? Cmon man, your talking crap about the cell and look at the games we been getting? And with supposedly with less RAM then the 360. You should be happy The ps3 is evolving into a beast and with the software to back it up. I feel like a kid again thanks to all the new IP’s.
palaeomerus
Are you professional investor? Most of them say you should try to invest directly in a company with an eye towards the long term and look at that company comprehensively when doing so.
Why are you whining about the cell not being a big deal in computing anymore? It just didn’t work out the way that Sony thought it would. PS4 isn’t even likely to use it. Accept it.
As to being happy, I AM happy.I have all three consoles and don’t need to worry about one to the point that I start thinking it has magical powers. Looking at the games we’ve been getting, most of them are obviously inferior to how PC games look which depend on NEWER GPU’s.
Saying ‘PS3 is a beast’ is like saying that ‘Sega does what Nintendon’t because of blast processing’. It’s just a cheesy commercial slogan that is supposed to make you feel good. In terms of hardware NONE of the consoles are beasts (we used to call them screamers! LOL!) or cutting edge anymore. They can still make some great looking games but they are ALREADY outclassed. They are already back to being the middle. The PS3 isn’t really evolving except to get cheaper. And that’s a good thing.(Unless you want to get excited about PSN and to me that’s kind of like getting excited over a TIVO dashboard update). 360 is about as much of a beast as 360 anyway. Games on both systems tend to look pretty similar and often the only “REAL” game to worry about seems to be seeing just how far fanboys of a particular system can publically overstate the virtues of some exclusive game or some feature or other. Both systems have exclusive games that look great that the opposite fanboys can’t seem to wait to crap all over for the stupidest possible reasons. Some people even take this as a cure to crap all over the multiplatform games which I think have been REALLY SPECTACULAR this generation.
Every console out right now has “the software to back it up”. Everyone. The one with the least appealing software collection (to me) is also the one that has the weakest hardware and is STILL way out in front in sales.
I’m sorry that you think I am condemning Sony (I’m not, I just think it makes sense to discuss the ups AND the downs of a company) and I’m also sorry that you think I’m fighting with you. I’m just offering opinions and facts in the spirit of discussion.
I also enjoy the emergence of new IP’s. There’s nothing magical about that though. MS is bringing out new IPS too. So is Nintendo. So are third party multiplatform publishers.
I was responding to Man_of_the_Year anyway so I’m not sure why you’d take anything I said in my response to him personally.
Anyway I wouldn’t invest in Sony just because you like PS3 and the share price seems a bit low right now. Nor would I invest in MS just to get on board before they launch Natal. I think it’s best to think like an invester and not a gamer when you invest. If you get your stock tips from a web forum about video games…that’s probably not a good thing.
UsCoMmAnDeR
MOTY has admitted several time he is an investor. Dont discuss slaes with him because Im sure he studies it way more often than probably anyone on this site.
palaeomerus
I don’t think that amounts to very much credibility in terms of investment advice on a games site forum.
mackroscopik
I think Sony would have outsold Microsoft if they were the same price and launched at the same time, but since the PS3 was late AND $600 it was permanently set back.
Ramses
just another fair and balance editoria coming from Foxnew*cough* Torrance.
c’mon Daxter the evidence is right there hitting u with the face with a sledgehammer, torrance is a closeted xbot.
“Why didn’t Sony pass Microsoft like they did with Sega when they had a 1yr lead?”
>SEGA SATURN<
"Also, if Sony could have overtaken Microsoft’s market share if they launched together, how come they haven’t overtaken Nintendo’s market share yet? The Wii and PS3 were launched the same week and Nintendo is now the market leader after passing Microsoft. If you are going to use silly logic, apply it to everything."
to answer your question. this isnt the same console wars that were 10 years ago. things change.
Da_Dios
Good points Torrence.
But you left out obvious valid Scenarios:
1- What if they were both released at the same time, do you think Backwards compatibility would have been a factor in initial sales? GOW II came out in march FF XII came out at the end of October. I know when i got me PS3 at launch i brought PS2 game still and played them on my PS3, who’s to say this wouldn’t have become a deciding factor. That would obviously have favored Sony in Hardware sales.
2- What if Microsoft still experienced it’s RROD, E 68, E70 and other famous faulty hardware errors as it did even with the launching hypothetically a year later? They had the hardware built and in QA well before it was actually released in 05 and it still happened anyway. Who’s to say it would have forgone MORE QA with the extra year let alone pick up the faults. Let’s not forget that it took them years to correct these issues, we’re on what, our forth or fifth chipset now?
3- Speaking of launch titles, How can we determine that some games on the 360 would have magically overridden all the games released in the 360s actual launch. So now Elder Scrolls and Battlefield 2 would just be pushed back to some arbitrary date just for a new and unproven IP no one knows. Hey Hitman came out for the 360 before gears did so wouldn’t that be a launch game? Gears would have came out but more than likely not as a launch game… With as many actual launch title that were released who’s to say Epic wouldn’t have preferred their title be released in a more generous window say like Jan-Feb of 07.
4- Here’s one you didn’t consider. What if microsoft had an Elite available at launch. Think about it an Elite was made 4 months after the PS3 launch…. With the option of HDMI out Sony couldn’t really play that whole HD nonsense now could they? Just the blu-ray which at the time was still an unknown factor for many consumers.
5- What if Microsoft DIDN’T have a supply shortage in 06 and they were able to meet demand?
Torrence Davis
All those games you mentioned that came out prior to Nov 2006 would have been launch titles. That was one of my points, not just Gears Of War.
As far as the Elite, that’s something I didn’t consider. See DaDios follows instructions. This is what I wanted everyone to do. Also, if HD-DVD was built in that means every Xbox would have had HDMI.
waterhidden
Playstation beats xbox at Alexa fight
http://www.alexafight.com/?site1=playstation.com&site2=xbox.com
mboojigga
http://www.alexafight.com/?site1=hiphopgamershow.com&site2=thebitbag.com
HHGShow Vs Thebitbag lol
playstation 3 repairs
asassasasasasa
Shaun Michael Cox
i dont know, the playstation brand is still strong but at that launch price point they were asking for a slow start whatever the release date. impressive article torrence.