I’ve seen arguments daily about how the PS3 exclusive games look better than the 360 exclusive games. Not only that, but people are also saying that the 360 can’t do games like MGS4 or Uncharted. I’d like to know why people are even posing these arguments. If you aren’t a developer, how can you say what each system can and can’t do? This Davis Daily is dedicated to the PAAG(Pointless Arguments About Graphics).
February 17, 2009 at 11:35 am
Davis Daily 02-17-2009: Pointless Arguments About Graphics
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Do you have a HDTV or play PC games on the highest settings ??
Sorry Torrence leader of the 360defence team i guess he touch a nerve
If you can get a Blu-ray or DVD for the same movie for the same price ,what will you get? Blu-ray or DVD!!
Will you play KILLZONE 2 ON a SD or HD TV? Will you play SF4 ON a SD or HD TV?
@leader of the 360defence team ghost busters has been dumb down on ps3
I think we’re hearing more about the ps3′s “supposedly” graphical superiority is because during ps3′s first year, when the original Gears of War was stomping on the first generation of of ps3 titles, it was boasted about to no end. I remember after it came out, if you went to almost any site with a ps3 game article on it, the response was always “gears. doesn’t look as good as gears. gears.”. No matter what game it was, it was shoved back in your face, as if it was the only game that existed. I myself got sick of hearing about gears just as you are getting sick of hearing about Killzone2. It’s the same situation, with the the consoles in question in reversed roles. (I played the hell out of gears like everyday with my friend during that time, so I wasn’t a butt-hurt ps3 owner or anything like that.) I guess what I’m trying to say is, I think it’s for the most part, a backlash to the xbox enthusiast’s “Gears.” nonesense. I remember when I got my PS3 shortly after its release, I rented Full Auto 2, and NFS Carbon, both were multiplats at the time. I returned them BOTH during the same afternoon, and honestly felt a bit cheated. I then rented R:FOM, not sure what to expect– and I was blown away, there was like, no comparison to it and the other games out at the time. You would have thought they were from two different generations. I realized then that I couldn’t take multiplats too seriously, and as a result, never used them in comparisons. But now, as far as comparing multiplatform titles go, the gap has shortened almost to the point of completely shut. Aside from the obvious installations, the only noticeable differences are the bugs that get treated through patching and maybe, maybe, a few lower textures here and there. (not much to compare when it’s a system-to system port, having the architectures vastly different). I completely agree with everything depending on the developers. I’ve been saying that forever, and I hope it becomes much clearer to people that it’s not SONY, or MICROSOFT that dictates the quality/equality of multiplats (dlc aside), it’s the developers and how they use the tools they’re given. And Torrence, were u getting worked up as much while people were using gears as ammo the same way? I’m totally agreeing with you on everything. Everything but the fact that you didn’t address what happened during the 360′s first 2 years on the market. It was what’s happening right now, the only difference is the fanboys switched sides. Surely you didn’t miss all that right? It only went on for about 2 years if not more now that there’s a sequel for gears?
RE5 sucks its really RE4.5 dark void looks like an unreal game
Yes, I did hear all that crap about Gears. Do you remember when I was bitching because people were saying Gears is the only good 360 game? I got sick of it. Plus, thebitbag.com got started after the first year of the 360. I would have bitched about it during that time but I just wasn’t doing much shit back then. Now that I have this site and this show, I get to complain as soon as i reach my boiling point. I just want to know why there are so many graphic boasting arguments on the PS3 side. If they are doing it for vengeance then they are no more mature than the 360 fools who were bashing the PS3 the first year.
Looks like some people are being but hurt by what torrence has said….. But if you actually listen he speaks the truth… listen to warzone etc… he will praise games that deserve it and talk bad about games that also deserve it…. I dont understand the grade school mentality that individuals are having with their consoles…. its like the my dad is stronger then your dad argument… so sad…. Anyway I dont think you guys open up your extremist fanboy eyes to realize the point he is trying to get across to you… and I really dont feel like explaining it because if you can see for yourselves …. then there is no hope for you….. And for the morons asking if he plays on hdtv etc… did you see the fucking big black screen next to his head??? wtf do you think that is douche bags…. ( sigh ) lol Anyway good daily torrence.. keep it up
o shiza! almost fergot… if you guys are so hell bent on graphics… realize one of the best games that came out last year looks like as good as a game 4 years ago on a pc….. Cough cough* Left 4 Dead… and is probably one of the best games last year… and offers tons of fun for everyone…and nobody is worrying about stupid graphics arguments when playing it.
@ Torrence It seems like mentioning Killzone 2 in articles is something more of a trend these days. Sure it looks amazing, will probably do the ps3 some good, but I mean, when you say PS3 fanboys and all that stuff, it’s not just the people. Hell, a lot of 360 owners are loving what they’re seeing, Earlfly even said he heard ppl on XBL talking positively about it didn’t he? What I’m getting at here is, it’s either THAT GOOD, or the media is just beating it, much like a dead horse (making glue, oceans of it at this point). The people seem pumped, but the media is going crazy with all the bullshit KZ2 stories. It just attracts those fanboys, and I’d go so far to say it encourages them. I’m sure you’ll find just as many speculative articles about the game as you find fanboys posting stuff about it. Anyways, keep doin ur thing Torrence. It’s good to see that The Bitbag isn’t flooded with that shit. Much easier on the eyes… It’d be cool to see you call out the otehr sites that just constantly go on about the game because you call tell them “look, we’re doin great here, and how many KZ2 articles do we have?”
see John Carmack http://www.gametrailers.com/player/37903.html John Carmack Know What he is doing This is not BS Rage is MP John Carmack is not a fanboy!!! Why Do FanBoys Do it Because It Makes Fan boys from the other side CrY
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again Torrence, this generation of gaming is actually turning out to be the worst in history. Don’t get me wrong, the games we’ve played are unlike anything we’ve ever seen, but there is an issue now and its PS3 fanboys writing about 5 paragraphs of the systems graphical horse power, who gives a crap? Then on the other side, 360 fanboys bringing up the Gears of War argument. I have a feeling that these cunts are between 13-16 years old and its now starting to look like a radical fundamentalism. PS3 and X360 are both great systems and we all know that they are capable of incredible graphics, why can’t these fu@@ers just leave it at that. If a game has amazing graphics but doesn’t play well, it still sucks (ANYONE REMEMBER GENJI ON PS3?)
keep up the good work Torrence
DICE 09: Ghostbusters: The Video Game Engine Officially Announced The game’s developer is offering up Infernal Engine demos at the show. February 17, 2009 – Terminal Reality officially announced today their revolutionary next-generation development platform, the Infernal Engine. This new technology powers the much-anticipated Ghostbusters: The Video Game, a continuation of the Ghostbusters story. Terminal Reality will also license the Infernal Engine to third parties and is currently scheduling private meetings at the DICE Conference this February 17 – 20 in Red Rock, NV. The Infernal Engine offers excellent cross platform support and is compatible with all of the leading gaming systems as well as the PC. Thanks to the extensive experience of the team at Terminal Reality, the Infernal Engine takes full advantage of next generation hardware while scaling easily to all systems. Veteran monster-killer The Stranger (from Terminal Reality’s 1999 hit title NOCTURNE) appears here in his new incarnation, updated to take full advantage of Infernal Engine’s latest tech advances. The Stranger will be featured in upcoming Infernal Engine technology demos. The Stranger. The Stranger. The Infernal Engine provides an advanced physics solution, powerful particle system, and rendering features that provide ultra-realistic environments and characters. On top of a great feature set, the Infernal Engine comes with best-in-class support and a streamlined content pipeline to maximize productivity. “Terminal Reality’s Infernal Engine is a breakthrough in efficiency for game development middleware. Our licensees can leverage their work across more platforms, in less time, than any other engine – giving them a competitive edge critical for success,” said Joe Kreiner, VP of Sales and Marketing with Terminal Reality. “Our licensees get stunning visuals, fast time to market, and the support of Terminal Reality – one of most experienced independent game developers in the industry.” “Infernal’s integrated toolset and speedy build process help us prototype levels and gameplay quickly. Our artists have a lot of control over the look of the game compared to other popular engines. Additionally, the pipeline allows painless model importing and their material system is easy to use. The built-in scripting system and object tools allow designers and artists to be more flexible with limited resources, while the cross-platform nature of Infernal reduced our overall multi-SKU development risk,” said Dan Irish CEO, Threewave Software. Terminal Reality will be showing the Infernal Engine to interested developers and publishers by appointment only at the DICE Conference in Red Rock, NV from February 17 – 20, 2009. Companies interested in the Infernal Engine licensing information can visit http://www.infernalengine.com or email enginesales@terminalreality.com with a DICE appointment request. Atari has released new gameplay assets from Ghostbusters: The Video Game, a title based on the classic films and featuring the original film cast: Bill Murray, Dan Aykroyd, Harold Ramis and Ernie Hudson. When Manhattan is once again overrun by ghosts, players take on the role of a new recruit joining the Ghostbusters team. The game is being developed by Terminal Reality and Red Fly Studios for the Xbox 360, PS3, PC, PS2, Nintendo Wii and Nintendo DS. Ghostbusters: The Video Game is expected on June 16th, 2009 in North America and June 19th, 2009, worldwide. “In taking on such a storied franchise as Ghostbusters, everyone at Terminal Reality was determined to create a unique gaming experience that would excite and enthrall fans of the original movies,” said Kreiner.
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/954/954531p1.html
“As a species we’re fundamentally insane. Put more than two of us in a room, we pick sides and start dreaming up ways to kill one another. Why do you think we invented politics and religion? ” Ollie Weeks {Stephen King’s The Mist, 1980} @ Torrence The reason why we are seeing so many posts arguing the graphical superiority of the PS3 is because for the last 2 years we have been seeing multiplatform video comparison posts. These video comparisons (some of which are fake) have been used by 360fanboys to piss-off PS3fanboys by asking the question “Where is this amazing power of the Cell we keep hearing about?” So now the PS3fanboys are retaliating by saying “Killzone 2 is our new God and even if you are a non believing 360 heretic, it still loves you.” lol
the main problem is that people refuse to accept, and get it through their thick skulls that the ps3 is the more advanced of the 2 systems, thanks to the cell processor and bluray. but it’s harder to develop for due to it’s architecture relying heavily on parallel coding. once a game is “fully optimised” to make use of the SPUs on the cell, there is no way the 360 can keep up. every dog has his day. now it’s the ps3′s turn, the 360 currently has nothing that can compare to what the ps3 has to offer in terms of graphical prowess when it comes to exclusives, and i don’t think that will ever change. however, one game i do have my eye on is rage(an absolute pc version buy for me). and this whole argument about games taking 4-5 years to be developed oh the ps3, vs 2-3 years on the 360, is a load of fucking bullshit. the ps3 was launched in march 2007 in the UK, and by my counting that’s less than 2 years to wait for KZ2. uncharted came out 07 and still has the best textures in any console game to date, and uncharted 2 is coming in 09(2 years later) upping the ante. insomniac also release a game every year on the ps3. and torrence you sound like a hypocrite, one minute you say that it’s not fair to compare exclusives(gears vs KZ2), but then you go on to say that you’re sure that uncharted and MGS4 can be done on the 360, as though i’m to take your word over kojima’s and naughty dog’s. you clearly prefer the 360 over the ps3 and there’s no point in pretending otherwise, afterall there’s nothing wrong with having a preference, and that doesn’t make you a fanboy, it’s the toxic gaming media that made it that way, with assholes like jeff keighley and many many others.
The graphics conversation is kinda crazy. I choose to remain quiet not because I’m not a dev, but because the 360 is a very powerful machine and so is the PS3. I still am amazed by Gears 2. It is absolutely breath taking. Uncharted is amazing and so is MGS4 and Killzone 2. I don’t know why they keep popping up. It’s a fanboy war. You spend way too much time on Davis Dailies and the Warzone addressing “Why do fanboys do [insert it here].”
@jmd749 really??? like really???? LoL K bro first of whoopty woo Killzone 2 …2 years after ps3 comes out … yeah forget about all that time it was being developed and shown b4 the ps3 even came out? See what ive noticed from you guys is that you will call someone like torrence out and call him a fanboy…yet when he says something and hes unsure he is willing to tell people that its in his opinion….. yet I see people like you etc who tend to talk like their opinions are actually facts…. and thats a big problem….. who said uncharted cant be done on 360??? nobody… insomniac just doesnt make 360 games…. Kojima and them never said mgs4 on the 360 is not doable… they might say your not going to see it… but doesnt mean it cant be done….it all depends on the engine and the amount of time these developers want to put into these games….. its funny though because all you guys like to judge everyone else but yourselves…..especially since if you listen to the dailys and warzones etc… because you guys are talking out of your ass right now…… anyway it looks like the whole point about what this daily was talking about is evident in the comments that are shown…. since normal people who have the consoles do not care about whos selling more… who has the best looking game etc….they just want to game….
whoops edit lol ^^^^ its funny though because all you guys like to judge everyone else but yourselves…..especially since if you listen to the dailys and warzones etc…youd know that in the end most of the people on the bitbag just like to play games and will tell you their honest opinion and not sugar coat it for the masses….. whoops edit lol
Bah. For fanboys, it’s retaliation for sure.. For the media, it’s just another one of those stories that takes longer to wear out than most. When one thing catches, everything else has to latch on to catch some shine (maxim, Edge, random sites that apparently don’t exist and the glorified bloggers that are constantly belting out stories for hits with flamebait.) It looks as if it’s all slowing down though. Killzone2′s degree count topped out at 155k on N4G, and the rest of the news is slowly evening out. This seems to have happened since the demo released, oddly enough. I’m wondering if it’s one of those “calm before the storm” situation, and will all the hype and fanboy retardedness pick back up after Feb. 27th?
@Torrence Huh, it’s funny that you stayed calm through the entire debate.You usually start freaking out and calling them stupid but you stayed calm.It gave it a more professional feel.Wonder if you can keep that up.
*I sure hope not. Otherwise, Google is gonna have to implement a Killzone2 filter into their search engine soon enough. Toooooo much KZ2 stuff.
why so serious? this shit is funny lol. good luck with changing their mind. this will never end! you sound like Ash in Pokemon the first movie, in the final scene where he tried to stop all the pokemon from fighting each other, the only diference is they listened…oh wait he had to sacrifice himself to end the battle. very emotional scene T_T. Pokemon that is. best thing to do is to play the games. people opinion don’t matter. just play the games. can’t wait till killzone 2 one more week. yay!!! and resident evil 5
resident evil 5 in march. mkay
Dude, I don’t think anyone here likes pokemon so….a…..Yeah. How old are you anyway?If your still watching pokemon I sure hope your only like 13 or something.People really need to grow out of that crap.
@METtAL-GAMER, yeah just like people need to grow out of video games! yeah i see what u mean man! im 24 by the way. but i remember watching it when it came out, which was in 2000 i think but you seem to have a problem with me remembering pokemon.so im sorry for offending you in any shape or form -_-
You don’t still watch it do you?Eh I guess it doesn’t really matter.If that’s your thing than just fine.I really shouldn’t be judging people but whenever I see 50 year olds lining up for a pokemon game it just makes me laugh.
lol im roaring at the pokemon reference lol….. bahaha lol… and sadly I knew what you were talking about since my little brother used to watch that stuff lol
@METtAL-GAMER,no i don’t watch it anymore but you might actually be surprise that some individual have a good memory of what happened in their childhood, pokemon was a big thing back then.some people loved it and some hated it and i was one of those that liked it especially the gameboy games…just would like to say i wasn’t 24 in 2000 i am am 24 now. mmkay
I think it is important to compare exclusive games because they are essentially the benchmarks for each system, unless the multiplatform games are good enough to be considered as a benchmark such as COD4. So yes, games like GT should be compared with Forza, and etc. I also personally do believe that developers would always make all versions of their games to be about the same because people would complain for the “unfair” treatment otherwise. One version might be slightly more superior to the other but are never enough to make a huge impact. I think one of the greatest design philosophies from IW is that they create both console ports of their games at the same time and rate and therefore, giving quality products to both platforms. However, I doubt IW would go an extra mile with either consoles because that would deviate their trend. Instead, they would try to maximize both ports at the same rate, and therefore, giving almost-equal products that everyone would be happy about. If we do not compare exclusive games then what do we compare with? As you said before and I am paraphrasing you that most multiplatform games are generally the same and that you have not seen any developers saying that either console can do better than one or the other. Correct me if I am wrong. If that is the case, then a comparison is never possible. Also, I believe that PRs from these developers only say that the consoles are equal because they do not want what they say affect their sales. Seriously, I do not think I would ever hear any multiplatform developer saying “the PS3 is better†or “the 360 is better.†It is bad for business and they would lose their audience from either side; except for Valve of course. Gabe obviously loves the PC, dislikes both 360 and PS3, and praises the Wii. Frankly, I think asking a multiplatform developer whether a console is superior is unfair. It puts them on the spotlight I would never expect an honest answer from them. Not that I am saying that they are lying. I just think it is a possibility.
Torrance, Lets take dead space, or call of duty… Why would one compare each version to each other? my point is that any “good” multiplat is gonna look the same.. but say we do it ur way and compare any “good” multiplat game like those right? ok. so what is the conclusion we come to? say the 360 version of call of duty 4 is 10 times better than the ps3 version right? so everyone concludes the 360 is better… But then theres killzone 2 which blows it away right? so u see what i’m saying, it doesn’t solve anything. so the xbox call of duty blows the ps3 call of duty out of the water, But killzone 2 blows the xbox call of duty away… u see how the experiment gets fucked up? and doesn’t conclude with any true information… The only way to truly find out which system is better is to have Epic games or GG make an engine SOLEY for the 360 spend 4 years making a game, then make an engine SOLEY for the ps3 and spend another 4 (or whatever) years) and see which one looks better. Second best way is to take the best from each system and come to a raw conclusion in which looks better… I hear what ur saying, just cause it hasn’t been done doesn’t mean it can and all that but its all we have to work with. Comparing multiplats solve NOTHING, and I’m surprised u hadn’t seen the holes in that theory before u said it. I say fuck comparing in general because since developers will never do what i said above, there will be nothing worth comparing to each other without flaws… by now u said it, i say it, ps3 probably has more potential due to the processing power, and capacity of the format. but just because of that, doesn’t mean 360 can’t have better games, in some cases it does… but this comparison is IMPOSSIBLE. there is no comparison another example, take Fear 2 right? well the developers said they split the game up and tweaked the game for each system instead of porting it raw with the first one… ok so gears and killzone look better than fear,(yes, they do) so why are we comparing the two versions of fear together? u get what I’m saying? everyone needs to just shut the fuck up and play games… good show, peace
My version of fear 2 looks better than yours.Hahaha.
I play pokemon…
Ya well your a hardcore japan/anime gamer so you most likely play everything that’s japanese.
I preferred Monster Rancher back in the day :\ Sorry
It was either run through grass to catch some pokemon, buy multiple catriges/gameboys to get the traded ones—or… scavenge the earth for discs to generate monsters from (exciting shit right there). Still haven’t seen a game even until today innovate like that. I’m still amazed by it, even though I haven’t played any MR title in years. Why the hell are we talking about Pokemon??? hahah
What are u Talking about son ? Cats used to talk about graphics last gen too . It was all about how the xbox was graphically superior to the ps2 a;; day . Stop acting like u know everything .stick to what u know i love the bitbag but damn yall be trying to act like yall the end all Mecca of the true gamer, when some of you bleed Biased plasma.
Sorry Torrence but with all due respect you don’t know what you’re talking about. I heard several developers multi platform developers say that they can’t do on the Xbox what they can do on the PS3. Epic even said that they pretty much maxed out the Xbox 360 with Gears 2. I know where I read that but I don’t feel like digging it up for proof right now though. The guy above posted a link showing a developer for Rage saying that the Xbox 360 will take 3 discs to get the same graphical quality of the PS3 version.
Also Torrence, this is why people say that certain people are biased against the PS3. Nobody had a problem with this last gen when the Xbox 1 was more powerful than the PS2. Only when the favor is in the PS3′s corner does people have a problem with it. I heard you say in Davis Daily up there that a developer said that both system can do the same and you believe him but when the Ghost buster developers said that they had to dumb down the Xbox version you didn’t believe him. You picked what you wanted to believe. You do seem a little biased toward the Xbox. What you should be sick of is all of these articles claiming that the PS3 needs saving and is almost dead. There is a whole lot more hate against the PS3 but you don’t seem to notice it. That’s just what I see from you. No disrespect to you but we got to keep it real.
@truegamer i was about to type the same thing “I heard you say in Davis Daily up there that a developer said that both system can do the same and you believe him but when the Ghost buster developers said that they had to dumb down the Xbox version you didn’t believe him. You picked what you wanted to believe.” i like torrence, but he definitely regards information in favour of the 360 way more than the ps3(i remember when he discovered that with prototype 7.1 surround sound was possible on the 360 he was so ecstatic), he always acts as though both the 360 and ps3 are equally as powerful. the gap between the visuals of 360 exclusives and ps3 exclusives will only get wider, and that’s a fact, and it’s a fact that only bothers 360 loyalists.
and torrence, i absolutely do not agree that multiplatform games should be used to fairly compare the 2 systems’ visual capabilities, that just doesn’t make any sense. the only way that can be remotely valid is if a game like rage were to be released and looked better than both the 360′s and ps3′s best looking exclusives, and looked the same on both platforms. and still, it could be argued that there was more headroom left on one system than the other.
Ps3 exclusive have better graphics than 360 its true just get over it. Multiplat games are made even across all platforms.
and it kills me how people always say well if you been makin the game for 4 years of course it will look better lol wasnt too human in dev for 3 or 4 years.time doesnt matter just look at all the great exclusive time just doesnt matter to me. i would rather have a quailty product than just a game they make in 1 year tops.
One more thing Torrence, it’s stupid to compare multi platform games because they are made to be close to equal. Developers will not purposely make one much better than the other. What happens is a game is made for one system first and the other system gets the port and it’s a well known fact that whoever gets the port gets the slightly lesser version. It’s also fact that the PS3 is harder to develop for and some 3rd party developers give a half hearted attempt on the PS3 port. Usually games are made for the Xbox first and the PS3 gets the port. However, Ghost busters is being made for the PS3 and then ported to the Xbox and they went too far with it on the PS3 that they had to dumb it down for the Xbox whether you want to believe it or not. A lot of it is space. The Xbox uses DVD9 which only holds 8gb while Blu-Ray holds 50gb. There is plenty of room on the Blu-Ray disc for you to put pure uncompressed graphics on it that’s impossible to do on a DVD9 disc.
Personally, I would be lying my @$$ off, if I said graphics don’t matter to me. This is/was the main reason for me purchasing my next-gen console (PS3), this why I spent money on a 7.1 surround system & a 62″ HDTV. I wanted to be WOWED by the latest & greatest visuals that video gaming has to offer without having the need for constantly having to upgrade my hardware annually. I researched for a long time before making my next-gen purchase and I’m happy with the decision I made. I can’t speak for anyone else, but graphics DO matter to me in a big way! If it didn’t then why the hell would I spend all that money, when I could have just stuck to my SDTV & my PS2! I really don’t care what anyone else thinks or does with their gaming experiences because it doesn’t effect me in any way.
@JMD – “and torrence you sound like a hypocrite, one minute you say that it’s not fair to compare exclusives(gears vs KZ2), but then you go on to say that you’re sure that uncharted and MGS4 can be done on the 360, as though i’m to take your word over kojima’s and naughty dog’s.” I suggest you read this link: http://www.gamersreports.com/news/101/kojima-says-mgs4-demo-could-run-on-xbox360/ And again, unless you are a developer, you have no proof of what a system can and can’t do. Provide links and quotes of these developers that said games can’t be done on the 360. I’m waiting… @wongfume – All I’m saying is it’s better to compare multiplats against exclusives because you can’t compare KZ2 to anything on 360 because there is no KZ2 on 360. A game has to be the same spec for comparison. Look at Burnout Paradise. Are you saying you can’t compare those on each platform? You can’t compare ANY exclusives, even if they are the same genre. You can’t compare Halo to Resistance. Both games are different specs, different engines, different art, different textures..etc… @gameraxis – see above post and yeah, I say fuck comparison’s altogether too. @kapado – “yall be trying to act like yall the end all Mecca of the true gamer” Yep, we trying!
@True Gamer – “Sorry Torrence but with all due respect you don’t know what you’re talking about. I heard several developers multi platform developers say that they can’t do on the Xbox what they can do on the PS3.” and “I heard you say in Davis Daily up there that a developer said that both system can do the same and you believe him but when the Ghost buster developers said that they had to dumb down the Xbox version you didn’t believe him.” Please link articles where devs say 360 can’t do something. Please, shut me up. I’m begging you. Also, the reason I don’t believe what Terminal Reality said last year is because I’ve seen the latest Ghostbusters running on both platforms. They look astonishing. I couldn’t tell the difference between the two and it doesn’t look like there was a lack of objects on the screen at all. So if they did have a problem getting the 360 up to PS3 standards, it looks like the fixed it. I’VE SEEN BOTH VERSIONS SIDE BY SIDE….what have you seen? I did an interview with Terminal Reality. I’ll have the truth to this shortly. BTW, I already said this in DD. Did you miss it? @jmd again – “i like torrence, but he definitely regards information in favour of the 360 way more than the ps3(i remember when he discovered that with prototype 7.1 surround sound was possible on the 360 he was so ecstatic), he always acts as though both the 360 and ps3 are equally as powerful. the gap between the visuals of 360 exclusives and ps3 exclusives will only get wider, and that’s a fact, and it’s a fact that only bothers 360 loyalists.” Anytime I see a system do something that it’s not supposed to do I get excited. People, including myself, said PS3 couldn’t match the KZ2 trailer from 2005. It exceed it. I got excited. People said 360 couldn’t do 7.1. They did it, I heard it while in the THX theater. I got excited. Shoot me for getting excited about something groundbreaking in video games. @jmd yet again – “and torrence, i absolutely do not agree that multiplatform games should be used to fairly compare the 2 systems’ visual capabilities, that just doesn’t make any sense. the only way that can be remotely valid is if a game like rage were to be released and looked better than both the 360’s and ps3’s best looking exclusives, and looked the same on both platforms. and still, it could be argued that there was more headroom left on one system than the other.” There are several flaws in your logic. I’ll ask again. How can you tell what a system compares to another system based on exclusives? Do you mean to tell me that when you saw Genji on the PS3 you accepted that as what the PS3 could do? What about Tenchu Z on the 360? Plays well but looks like a PS2 game. Is that what you thought the 360 was capable of? Is it only when we see something that pleases our eyes that we are impressed? David Copperfield makes it look like he can fly, but it’s an illusion. Our eyes are fooled. Developers are technical illusionists. They can do things in software to make us believe we are seeing something else. Low poly count with super hi-res textures makes it look like a high poly count to our eyes. Don’t sit there and think that just because KZ2 is the best looking FPS to date, that it can’t be done on the 360. It’s the best looking…that’s it. Just like Gears is the best looking 3rd person shooter. That doesn’t mean that it can’t be done on PS3 which many 360 fanboys seem to claim. Unless you actually develop for both systems, where do you come off saying that exclusives are the best way to COMPARE a systems power? If you have a spec, an engine and graphics that are based off of the same 3D models, that is the only way to compare what each system can do. The only other limitation is the developer. So what other game on the 360 uses the Killzone 2 models, engine and spec? None. So how can it be compared to any 360 game? @Bucnasty – I’m not even going to comment on anything you type anymore until you start making some serious posts. @Truegamer – see response to JMD I advise you all who think I’m a 360 fanboy to read this article: http://www.thebitbag.com/2008/12/16/why-all-the-ps3-hate/ I advise all of you to listen to this podcast when I pull it out of the archives: http://www.thebitbag.com/2008/09/13/warzone-15-playstation-3-is-the-most-powerful-console-on-the-market-accept-it-and-move-on/ If you want to keep second guessing me and challenging me, I will provide data and info and prove you wrong. I will gladly admit I’m wrong when I’m wrong. Just please, prove me wrong first. I love you all and keep it coming! 
Peace! T
One more thing…I do believe that the PS3 will steam pass the 360 in graphical power in a year or so. I’ve always believed this. The 7 SPE’s will do wonders once devs figure out how to fully utilize them. It’s not going to make people buy more ps3′s though.
How you come up with such an absurd cristal ball prediction ? That when the PS3 graphics and games improve beyond the 360′s that people still wont buy the system. What is your criteria by which a console gets sales ? Netflix or blu ray porn. I joined this site cause i thought this “true gamers”motto was taken at least a bit seriously …im dissatisfied with you mr Davis your comments lately are missing the logical and sometimes smart train. Biased much .
I never said people wouldn’t buy the system, I said, “It’s not going to make people buy MORE PS3′s though.” Read it ten times if you have to and see if you can understand what I’m saying here. [EDIT] I just want to point out that this is how peoples words get mixed up. Kapado disrespected me thinking that my statement means that PS3′s don’t sell. Even after the links I’ve provided for him to READ, he still thinks I’m biased. Is there anyone who understood what I meant when I said, “It’s not going to make people buy MORE PS3′s though.”? Let me put it in some other words and see how Kapado responds. Here are my other words: Graphics don’t make people buy systems. Better graphics on the 360 won’t sell more 360′s. Better graphics on the Wii won’t sell more Wii’s. Ok one more time…. It’s not going to make people buy MORE PS3′s though. Waiting to hear your response.
http://www.gametrailers.com/player/37903.html Torrence, maybe I was wrong in accusing you of being an Xbox fanboy and I’m sorry but please take a look at this link. It’s about a 5 minute video. Here is the proof of what I was saying.
Torrence, some people are graphics whores and some people not so much. Graphics are important. If a game is good but have bad graphics then you have to knock off some points for that. It’s unaccepatable in this day and age. When I hear people talk about Gears 2 the first thing out of their mouths are how great the graphics are.
@tor you are right about the mgs4 thing, i should not have included mgs4 in my argument since storage was the main issue, but still a valid one since the 360 does not have a bluray drive being used for games, and to install a 50GB game on your console is just rediculous. and just to be clear, i don’t think you’re a fanboy, but i do think that you prefer the 360, and there’s nothing wrong with that. i’m primarily a pc gamer myself and i prefer the ps3, it’s the best value imo, free online, best hardware, bluray player and awesome exclusives. now when it comes to multiplatform games being used to fairly compare the 2 systems’ visual capabilities, i still disagree with you, and i already made it as clear as i possibly could. i guess we’d just have to agree to disagree. uncharted 2, GOW3, heavy rain, R&C:TOD2, and team ico’s new game are all games that are gonna further widen the visual gap between the 360 and ps3. but i have a keen eye on carmack’s upcoming game(rage) using his idtech5 engine adopting his megatexture technology, and i hope it doesn’t disappoint like quake warsET. ps: the length of time a game is in development does not dictate the final quality, e.g. KZ2, stalker and too human. and is your new rig finished as yet? i want the davis daily to be daily.:p
I think I’ll step into this one.Okay Torrence using multiplats is pointless because they are meant to be equal on each system.Exclusive are meant to be compared because they are usually the best looking games on each system and show the power of each system. Would you look at that.50 some comments for a davis daily.That’s even more than the warzone.Looks like this site is picking up a lot.Last year you were lucky to even get 25 comments and now it’s in the 50′s.Sweet.
@trugamer – I’ve seen that video a few times. The issue with Rage is storage, not system power. The 360 can do Rage exactly how they want it if they use the 3rd disk. @jmd – “you are right about the mgs4 thing, i should not have included mgs4 in my argument since storage was the main issue, but still a valid one since the 360 does not have a bluray drive being used for games, and to install a 50GB game on your console is just rediculous.” Agreed. “and just to be clear, i don’t think you’re a fanboy, but i do think that you prefer the 360, and there’s nothing wrong with that. i’m primarily a pc gamer myself and i prefer the ps3, it’s the best value imo, free online, best hardware, bluray player and awesome exclusives.” I only prefer the 360 for the controller and Xbox Live features. Nothing else. I LOVE the games both the 360 and PS3 offer equally. “now when it comes to multiplatform games being used to fairly compare the 2 systems’ visual capabilities, i still disagree with you, and i already made it as clear as i possibly could. i guess we’d just have to agree to disagree.” What are you comparing when you compare exclusives? Maybe that’s a more pertinent question. Are you saying to the world that the PS3 can’t handle Forza 2′s crash physics? Are you saying that the 360 can’t do the animations that are in KZ2? And if you are saying ‘can’t’ on both accounts, can you prove it? “uncharted 2, GOW3, heavy rain, R&C:TOD2, and team ico’s new game are all games that are gonna further widen the visual gap between the 360 and ps3. but i have a keen eye on carmack’s upcoming game(rage) using his idtech5 engine adopting his megatexture technology, and i hope it doesn’t disappoint like quake warsET.” My new rig should be finished by March. Maybe sooner. I want it to be Daily too. @Truegamer again – “Torrence, some people are graphics whores and some people not so much. Graphics are important. If a game is good but have bad graphics then you have to knock off some points for that. It’s unaccepatable in this day and age. When I hear people talk about Gears 2 the first thing out of their mouths are how great the graphics are.” People ARE graphics whores. HHG is a graphics whore and self admitted. I agree, you should knock off points for bad graphics. When I talk about Gears, it’s always about how fun it was to play. I didn’t even like Gears until I got to play it. The graphics did nothing for me until Gears 2(Waterfall = drool) Hope you guys respond. Peace! T
@Torrence What makes people buy more systems?
@zeroman – games, features and price. I’ve never ever bought a system because of the graphics. If that were true then that means I bought the 2600 for graphics. Graphics are great, but gameplay is more important. If graphics were the deal breaker on console purchases, I’m sure the Wii would be in 3rd place worldwide. I also believe that if graphics were what made people buy systems, then KZ2 would have 5 million + pre-orders.
@Torrence I’m sure that PC gamers are gonna disagree with you.All those graphics chips they buy.
@metal gamer – it’s all a matter of control. PC gamers like to change clock speeds and upgrade video cards and do all this shit. I used to be like that but I stopped. You know why? Xbox 360 and PS3. I can play the latest games without upgrading. Everyone wants to run Crysis at 60ps, full resolution and high res textures. It’s like an accomplishment or something. I refuse to spend $400 on a video card to play one game. To each his own though.
Yeah.I don’t know what’s up with them buying a new graphics card every 6 months.It’s cheaper to just buy a console.Buying both consoles might even be cheaper plus PC gamers have to wait for a game to be ported to the PC.Ex.Mirrors edge and GTA4.I’m not a PC gamer so don’t have to worry about all that.
60 comments.Wow.That has got to be the most comments for this site ever.
Why can’t everyone just stop arguing about what console can do what and just play games? Honestly, I don’t see the big deal with exclusives and multi-platforming. A game is a game, but it should be the developers that we would get after should the game fail to live up to the expectations of what the system can do. A great example would be that latest Golden Axe game. What a piece of shit that was. I remember SEGA saying that we could choose from 3 – 4 classes, play online, etc etc. But what happened? The game didn’t meet expectations, it was rushed, deadlines were late, blah blah blah. They finished up what they could before the game could get out and onto retail shelves. That’s business for ya in the gaming industry and business is what it’s all about in the end. SEGA fucked up and moved on with new projects. Took a dive with GA’s sales but kept on moving. Same shit happened with Dead Space and most likely with Dante’s Inferno. Dead Space 2 is on hold, for now, but let’s hope that the same artists who worked on that project comes back. Though I doubt it since they were let go, but what ever. I hope for the best for those guys. Getting back on topic. Who cares about what console can do better than the other? Can it play a game? That’s all that matters to me and would be the same for any other TRUE GAMER.
@Torrence How does a game peak your interest (pre release, pre demo)? What attracts you to a game?
Torrence, but the space is a very valid issue. All of that space on the Blu-Ray disc allows for uncompressed graphics and sound that you just can’t get on a DVD9 disc. Sure you can use 3 or 4 DVD9 discs but that shouldn’t happen these days and Microsoft charges the developer heavily after the second disc and that handicaps developers. The Xbox 360 is great but this gives the PS3 a huge advantage.
There can’t be any comparisons… If a dev is able to do a little better with one system than the other on a multiplat that’s fine, it will probably be unnoticeable, failing to prove any superiority. and torrance, i assume u agree that killzone2 looks better than gears 2 right, i thought i heard u say it? well there will never be a multiplat game that has such a drastic graphical difference as gears 2 compared to killzone 2. It’ll Never happen… that’s why multiplats can’t be compared. if one version is slightly superior fine, but it will never be such an impact were any sensible conclusion can be made. assuming each company is trying to do their best making games for their system, the only way to compare graphic fidelity is to take the best from each.. I’m telling u… and even that doesn’t do it… but its certainly better than comparing multiplats… its common sense. so basically if u take the top 5 best graphics games from the ps3, and take the top 5 from the 360, and if the worst on the ps3 side is equal or better than the best on the 360, we have a conclusion… read that last paragraph again please. Torrance, i can’t believe ur getting fucking attacked lol, but multiplat isn’t how. The pure numbers disagreeing with u should be enough to prove u wrong bro, don’t be stubborn lol
I’m done with this shit tho lol, i gotta go play my 640p ps3 street fighter 4 lol HHAHAHHAHAHAHHA
torrence u r a 360 fanboy just admit it have you ever seen a game like KZ2 on 360 have you have any one.im not the one that says it cant do it i just beleive what i see and i havent seen one game come close to KZ2 have you torrence i dont think so.you do a rant just cuz people say the ps3 have better graphics WTF
My dear Torrence Tsk tsk… Can I call you T-Dawg? The reason the wii is first place is simple, ” accessibility ” all these old and young people buying and playing the wii for that reason its easy to “do”. 2nd my girls sisters’s husband got a wii because the online 360 games and the hardcore gamers make it hard to enjoy the game. A weak point he makes but i see what hes saying A-holes online dont help. The price isnt that much of a problem the wii trumpets the cheapest 360 sku, but PS3 and 360 intimidate the newcomer & casual gamer the many buttons,looks harder they will need to buy an “expensive” HDTV to evolve in gaming so as a whole next gen is a complicated beast even for last gen gamers. 3rd your whole theory of ” im not a 360 fanboy i gotz a PS3 too ” holds no water, for I have a wii and cant wait to see it die a fast death.and many people feel the same having 3 consoles 1 or 2 are the stepchildren. The only reason you gotta show love to killzone2 is because you cant really deny.your not a RGZ but u sure biased towards 360 mad people saying it, its like that Mike Jackson thing u been touching young 360s for so long u dont wanna show big daddy love. But the Church of Sony is watching you son.
PS – love you site and i didnt mean to disrespect you as a man but yes at your biased and absurd comments. What you mean by “wont sell more ps3′s “your explanation sounded even more ridiculous specially after a few weeks bak you were praising netflix as a system selling feature. but prettyer graphics are not ? rationalize please.
@zeroman – “How does a game peak your interest (pre release, pre demo)? What attracts you to a game?” What is this a survey? I’d say that I really get peaked when a demo is released or I get the final details on gameplay. Gameplay mechanics are most important to me. The whole idea of a Ghostbusters game blows me away. I’ve been waiting for one that plays like the movies and this is it. I absolutely had no care for Gears Of War when I saw the first footage. I didn’t understand what all the hoopla was about. The long lines at E3 for Halo 1 when it was PC only…I didn’t get it. World Of Warcraft sucked balls until I learned about all the skills. I eventually loved all 3 games after looking deep into them and finally playing them. @kapado – I guess when I defend the PS3 I must be a PS3 fanboy then. When I’m defending the Wii this year because of it’s stellar line up then I’ll be a Wii fanboy. “What you mean by “wont sell more ps3’s “your explanation sounded even more ridiculous specially after a few weeks bak you were praising netflix as a system selling feature. but prettyer graphics are not ? rationalize please.” Did I say Netflix was a system seller!?!? Did I?!? Did I say that’s why people were buying Arcades? I think Anthony Canepa said that…not me. I said it gives you an added value. Go back to that episode and start listening at 145:00. Next…
No, its not a survey. I was just trying to figure out how your reasoning leads you to think that Graphics are not a huge selling point for systems and games. If “Graphics don’t make people buy systems”, then why do companies spend so much money redesigning their consoles to output better Graphics each gen? Why would developers wastes time and money creating software that produces better Graphics than their old games? The answer is simple. Graphics ARE a major selling point for games, and Graphic Power IS a major selling point for systems. @Torrence -”If that were true then that means I bought the 2600 for graphics. Graphics are great, but gameplay is more important.” If you are suggesting that you bought the 2600 because of the gameplay then your argument makes no sense, because the gameplay and graphics on the 2600 are on the same level. @Torrence -”If graphics were the deal breaker on console purchases, I’m sure the Wii would be in 3rd place worldwide.” The Wii argument is weak. Everybody knows that the Wii is only selling because it was marketed heavily to a non-gamer consumer base. My grandmother loves the Wii. Am I wrong?
@tor “What are you comparing when you compare exclusives? Maybe that’s a more pertinent question. Are you saying to the world that the PS3 can’t handle Forza 2’s crash physics? Are you saying that the 360 can’t do the animations that are in KZ2? And if you are saying ‘can’t’ on both accounts, can you prove it?” a very clever argument torrence, but one i’m prepared for. when it comes to forza’s crash/damage physics i can confidently say that the ps3 can handle it, and a lot more(since the SPUs are very good at physics(vector math)), forza is a very poor example of crash physics anyways, especially since burnout paradise and grid do it alot better, however when it comes to real driving physics nothing can topple GT5P. and i am yet to see a game on the 360 have the same level of animation quality of KZ2 and uncharted, again the SPUs afford ps3 games to have better animations as well. i really don’t get why you can’t see that exclusives are what defines a platform’s capabilities. ps: sorry about the late response, 5 hour difference here in the UK, i fell asleep.:p
“i really don’t get why you can’t see that exclusives are what defines a platform’s capabilities.” Exclusives do define a systems capabilities to a certain extent. Multiplats can do it too. We just haven’t seen it yet, especially on the PS3. I’d say I’m on the fence with KZ2. Let’s see what the rest of the year offers.
Just a note, I’ve never ever bought a system because of the graphics. NEVER. It’s always been the games that are offered. I do LOVE good graphics, don’t get me wrong. That’s not what I used to base a purchase on though.
“Let’s see what the rest of the year offers.” agreed, the only game i know of, that has the potential is RAGE. oh, i forgot, i know i’ve told you b4, but i hope you haven’t purchased your gpu for you rig as yet, i really think you should get a GTX260, it’s a much better card than the 4870, it has cuda, ageia physx support, a lot more dev support, better performance, great heat dissipation and a lot of overclocking potential. anyways, march is almost here, and it’d be cool to play some L4D and TF2 with you on steam.
“A game has to be the same spec for comparison.” But if they have the same specifications, what is there to compare? “Look at Burnout Paradise. Are you saying you can’t compare those on each platform?” Well, yes, mainly because I do not own a 360, nor copies of Burnout Paradise. But I do have a COD4 for my PC and PS3 and the PC version looks better. But it is kind of harsh to compare consoles to PCs considering that console remain constant until the next version comes out and PC varies based on the user. But if you are interested, please, tell me your comparison between the 360 version and the PS3 version of Burnout Paradise. I doubt it would be huge. “You can’t compare ANY exclusives, even if they are the same genre. You can’t compare Halo to Resistance. Both games are different specs, different engines, different art, different textures..etc…” Eh, when you benchmark a game, you generally ignore things like story, art, and etc. Every engine has there flaws but many are very stable and well developed. When benchmarking, one generally tend to look at numbers, such as the number of actual animation that goes on the scene, the amount of RAM and CPU power the game uses to process the animation and AI, the amount of polygons aloud in the screen, the maximum resolution the game may maintain without noticeable drop in frame rates, and etcetera. Look at Crysis for example. It is the benchmark of what a hardcore PC fanatic should aim for, but the story element was not that great. There is nothing wrong with benchmarks. All it does is tell everyone what the consoles are currently capable of. If a 360 or multi-platform developer manages to build a game that may be comparable with Killzone 2′s GRAPHICS, then that game would be the new benchmark for console when it comes to GRAPHICS. Though, even the term “graphics†is very general and can be broken up into many compartments. There are other stuff such as sound effects, and so on. Benchmarking also helps some developers to reach a goal and these games changes all the time. But yes, you can’t compare the games themselves. Like you can’t say that Killzone 2 is better than Halo 3 simply because the game looks better or that Halo 3 is better because better server support. But in general, you can’t compare games as a whole. Exclusive games are all different and multplatform games are generally, and should be, the same. “Exclusives do define a systems capabilities to a certain extent. Multiplats can do it too. WE JUST HAVEN’T SEEN IT YET, especially on the PS3. I’d say I’m on the fence with KZ2. Let’s see what the rest of the year offers.†Well, yes, that is the point, and that goes for both consoles. All we could do is look at the present and hope for the future. As for your video comment on the average gamer not caring about motion vectors, you are right. But it does tell what the system is capable of and what the future of gaming may look like and how technology is progressing. In general though, I do not see why people use these information on debates. But I do believe that they are worth talking about just for the sake of knowing. I mean, I still think that StarCraft: Brood Wars is still the best RTS and Street Fighter III: Third Strike and Super Street Fighter II Turbo are the besting fighting games, and that has nothing to do with graphics or engine specifications.
@wongumfie “In general though, I do not see why people use these information on debates. But I do believe that they are worth talking about just for the sake of knowing.” it’s not a debate about games’ graphics, but rather if console A can do better graphics than console B. ever since there were different Atari’s and Commodore’s and the such, there has been whining about graphics. what people need to do is be mature enough to accept that console A is capable of better graphics than console B and move on and put the focus back onto the games.
Who cares if console “A” can do better graphics than console “B”?It should be about the great games rather if one game better graphics than the other.Everyone knows the PS3 is more powerful as it’s a year newer so why the debate?
*Scrapes away the dead horse* There! No more arguing!
“oh, i forgot, i know i’ve told you b4, but i hope you haven’t purchased your gpu for you rig as yet, i really think you should get a GTX260, it’s a much better card than the 4870, it has cuda, ageia physx support, a lot more dev support, better performance, great heat dissipation and a lot of overclocking potential. anyways, march is almost here, and it’d be cool to play some L4D and TF2 with you on steam.” I’m building this for video production, not gaming. I will load a game or two just to test it though. I’ll never use an Nvidia again. ATi all the way!
hopefully after this davis daily, the console war BS will subside, at least till ps4 and 720. oh, i remember now, you said you had some back luck with nvidia cards b4.lol i’m disappointed to hear you won’t be gaming much, especially with a rig like that, but maybe that will change when you experience the awesomeness that is pc gaming.:)
I’ve always been more of a 360 kinda guy, but these games Sony is coming out with have my jaw on the floor. I hate the fact that some people compare a third person title to a first person title. Both systems have amazing games, and I wish people would just realize it and shut up. Also, Torrence I agree that Uncharted could be done on 360. It’s unfortunate that we havn’t seen anything like Uncharted on 360, but hopefully we will sometime in the near future. Anyhow, keep fighting the good fight, and I’ll sit and stare at my calendar until the 27th…
jaffe basically just told some biased journalist from MSNBC to fuck off with their biased bullshit.lol http://criminalcrackdown.blogspot.com/2009/02/is-this-biased-journalism-or-is-it-just.html
@JMD Lol ya I saw that.That’s awesome.