June 16th, 2008
1v1#5
by Lee Yi
Jon and Lee are reunited
Topics:
- MLG SD
- NPD
- BD on 360
- Games as Art
- Some egomaniac J-developer
Games discussed:
H.A.W.X., GTA IV, MGS4, Iron Man (PS2), Bioshock, Every Extend Extra Extreme, Rez, SCIV,
UT3 360, Marvel: Ultimate Alliance 2, Ace Combat 6, DBZ:BL, Rock Band, Wii Fit
Stumble it!
View all posts by Lee Yi
Sup Jon and Lee? I just wanted to say that this is the first time I heard your guys’ show,and you really made my head explode when you commented about Metal Gears Theatrics like it was garbage.
First off, if you guys played the other metal gears, you would probably understand that the story telling is one of this games strengths. If you didn’t like it , fine. But seriously, what the heck are you doing on a video game pod cast if you have never played any metal gear games in your life? How did any of you get into this biz without actually playing one of the best games ever created? Let me guess, you guys are pc gamers huh?
I just don’t get where you guys are coming off about this whole thing. You guys smashed Metal Gear’s theatrics, and then you contradict yourself talking about how video games are an art. What the heck do you think Hideo was doing when he made them cuts? It was a form of art that he was trying to express and share with everyone. This is a story that has been in the making for over 21 years, how dare you guys talk crap like the man didn’t pour his heart and his soul into this game. You guys are basuda, and I don’t think you either of you are hardcore enough to be talking about games that you know nothing about.
Check this out man. Ive been gaming since I was 4. Ive owned damn near every system that has ever been out from the atari, turbographics 16, to the ps3, 360 and Wii? I’ve been noticing how alot of you video game podcast/ video game show host guys haven’t even played half the games I’ve ever played in my life, and how most of you guys are biased towards one thing or another, even though you claim not to be. It sickens me how you guys put out this crap information about games and expect everyone to believe in what you guys say when what you say should not be considered credible opinions and information. Do your homework boyz.
I’m sorry that Im acting harsh toward you guys. On a different note, I did agree with alot of things that you guys were talking about. Like for one, the little art bit you guys had, where you talked about how French artist made these really crazy remarks on what they thought art really was. Like tasting the color red and stuff like that. I was really feeling that.
You guy’s talked about Rez and some other game. Well, since you guys are obviously xbot’s , have you ever played Eternal Sonota? The whole game looks like a hand drawn painting. Its a living breathing masterpiece. Anyways, you said that you can get certain emotions and feelings from art, and thats what happend when I played this game.
There is this little part in the begining of the game when you play as this little girl and you have to take her home. Well, when she goes inside you can enter her bedroom and in it is this little cat laying on the bed. It just so happens that little cat looks just like my old cat that passed away a couple of months ago. As soon as I seen the cat my eyes starting tearing up. Then when I pressed to action button on the cat it meowed just like my cat did. I started bursting out in tears, it was like my cat was in the game.
I dont know why that one guy says video games isn’t art, but to me, video games are even better than art that you hang on the wall. Sometimes I get so wrapped up in games that sometimes I feel like I’m actually in the game, and if that isn’t art, then I dont know what is?
P.S. I hope you guys do well with this podcast, its not as good as the warzone, but its on par with other sites such as the hotspot and n4g’s if not better. Seroiusly though, next time you state you havent played a game in the series, try not to talk about the game like you know what the game is about, cause you don’t , you pretty much just made yourself look like an idiot.
Shredder, thanks for your passionate response. I really just have a few things to say in response.
First, there’s an old Chinese proverb that says, “Flowers look different to different eyes.” The latest numbers show that there are 13.38M PS3 out there. 19.19M Xbox 360s. I’m not going to bother with the Wii numbers as I consider them inconsequential to the discussion. That’s 32.75M total consoles. Let’s take 75% of that number (24.43M) to represent the fact that maybe half the Xbox 360 owners also have a PS3.
MGS4 sold 1.3M on its first day. To be fair, I am certain that the first week sales will show substantially more numbers, but let’s just take that number. 5% of the gaming population bought the game on its first day. Almost 10% of PS3 owners bought the game.
All of these numbers I present to you to say one thing . . . I am one of the approximately 95% of the gaming population that did not buy the game on the first day. Maybe some people waited till the weekend. Maybe some people can’t afford it. Maybe they don’t have a PS3. Regardless, my point is . . . the Metal Gear series is not for everybody.
If we “smash” the Metal Gear series, it is because we do not have an inclination to play said game after disappointment experienced with prior iterations. Does that make us less of a “gamer?”
Here at The Bitbag, the Editors have never touted themselves as “hardcore” gamers. Particularly with the 1v1 podcast, we are two guys who work full-time and have other priorities. Are we disqualified as gamers? I don’t think so.
I don’t think we contradicted ourselves either. We did not deny the work that Kojima put into the game. We discussed known issues regarding the game that do not require us to have played the game. We merely expressed that his style of game development is not one that we prefer. Although Titanic is one of the biggest movies of all time, I have never seen it and never plan on seeing it. It’s not my style. Does that make me less of a movie buff? I don’t think so.
We talk about what we know, and in our defense, I believe that is exactly what we did on the podcast. I believe there is a certain degree of bigotry in berating a fellow gamer for having an opinion.
Again, thanks for the comment. I think it’s awesome that our podcast moved you to post such a lengthy and thoughtful comment. Did you actually sit through the whole podcast? That’s awesome if you did (even thought you were peeved with us.) What that tells me is that we are talking about stuff that matters to people.
Listen dude, Im not saying anything bad about your podcast. It was a little boring at first, but then you guys started talking about interesting video game topics.
Okay, you are right, Metal Gear is not for everyone. The way you just explained sales numbers to me indicates you like throwing NPD sales charts as a way of showing who’s the boss in the industry. For one, the ps2 has over a hundred million install base, but I would rather not get into the numbers game cause just because people buy alot of certain systems( the Wii, the 360), doesnt mean that its the better of the brands.
Anyways, I’m try to make this short and simple. You guy’s not only represent The Bit Bag, but the video game community as a whole. Not only do we, the little guys, listen to your pod cast, but so do professionals in the industry. So to make gestures about games that you have no interest, in maybe you should’t be saying much of anything about said game, simply because you have never even played the freakin game.
Honestly, I dont care what you think about metal gear. Its just that your voice and opinions affect thousands, if not hundreds of thousands peoples’ outtake on any given game. Not just Metal Gear. I could understand if you ever played the game and didnt like it, but you have never even tried it,, so who the f*ck are you to judge something that you dont have a freakin clue about? Then you come to me talking more smack and throwing figures in the air,,,,,, thats not even part of the subject that me and you are having a discussion about.
You know what?,, just forget what I said. I never had any intentions of having a real argument about this, I could really give crap if what I say actually changes the way you do anything,, I was just really mad at the time ya know? So don’t mind me, I’m just a video game nerd thats been playing video games since I was a child and I have a emotional connection with my games. When someone talks shit, I like to back up my games with facts and my own credible oppinions. I try not to be biased as for I have owned damn near every system ever made. So ya,,, keep up the good work and make more podcast. Peace!
I wasn’t trying to throw numbers at you to show that Xbox was selling more. I was trying to show that of the people that have consoles, a good percentage are not as interested in MGS4 as you are.
Again, I want to reiterate . . . we only made comments regarding the series based on what we know. We did not make any comments that were speculation regarding the game. Based on what we know . . . we’re not interested. That’s all. You need to be fair and allow us to maintain this position. We are not misrepresenting the game industry. In actuality, I believe we may be representing a larger percentage of the game industry.
I myself have also played games practically since birth. I still play even though I am married and have kids, but that’s the thing, I am now married and have kids and work sixty+ hours a week. I believe I represent a good number of people that are in the same situation.
I love, though, that you are still sticking with us, even though I may have offended you and continue to offend you. That’s support I want.
Let me add my two pennies. Ever since MGS4 came out, pundits and fans having been obliterating anyone who criticizes the game for any reason. You don’t have to be a fan of MGS series to be critical of the game. In fact, people who aren’t fans are obviously going to be very critical of the game and/or series. I’m writing an editorial about it because I’m sick and tired of people slamming websites for giving the game an EIGHT, which has always been considered a good score until now. To MGS4 fans, this is the greatest game of all time and if you don’t like it you’re an idiot. I don’t think it’s the greatest game of all time. I think Kojima changed the game and others should take notice. I have it, I’m playing it, I think there’s too much exposition and I still like the game. IMHO, it is not a perfect game.
So please, cool your jets. We are all gamers here. I’ve been playing since the Fairchild was in existence. Yeah think about that one for awhile. So I know my shit. I’ve tried to like MGS series. Wait…I’ll save all this for my editorial.
Thanks for listening, glad to have you as a fan. We are here trying to do something different than IGN or Gamespot. We want to branch out to those areas that other websites fail to venture.
Peace!
Is it just me or does DA_SHREDER sound just a little too much like our own HipHopGamer?
Hmmm….
What? Do I sound like somebody who actually knows wtf I’m talking about? Somebody who actually states facts instead of my personal feelings about things? Go ahead and say what you want about me,, but at least spell my name right when you address me,. Quit being a noob and go play some year old games already. Obviously you dont have a ps3, broke @ss mo fo.
Your right Tor. I needed to cool down, and I did, I even apologized to Lee about being a hot head. But seriously,, whenever you guys feel like getting pwned. Hit me up.
Gamertag DA SHREDD3R
PSN Tag DA_SHREDDER
P.S. Candid, I know you gotta 360, if you do add me, I’d love to see if your gaming skillz are as good as your flaming skillz
In Candid’s defense, he has a PS3 as well . . . and I have confidence that at some point he will try his hand at MGS4.
I have one additional thought, though: Jon and I have been accused of expressing our personal feelings rather than stating the facts. Our podcast is not an investigative report on some news broadcast. It is two guys chatting about games. It is two guys expressing their personal feelings (perspectives/opinions).
I believe the only person who has taken this personal is our new friend, DA_SHREDDER. Heheh. Much love, bro. I just thought I would make that point.
The statements you expressed in your first comment above contained very few facts . . . just opinions . . . all of which I entirely respect.
My gamertag is groverTX. You did not just get served. I am on Xbox Live 24-7 (24 minutes, every 7 days). So, I probably will not be able to keep up with you, but you’re welcome to add me.
Shredder, remember that I actually have played through MGS2 and some of 3 (Snake Eater). My complaints with the game are more story-based, though I would say the game isn’t perfect. The issues I have are more with Kojima’s storytelling style and the subject matter. I really do feel some of the characters and plot events in the MGS series are, bluntly, quite silly. The contrast is even more jarring in light of the maturity of other themes in the series. Self-referential humor works for me in some settings; MGS isn’t one of them.
That said, my opinions are just that, opinions. I do feel I have enough experience with the MGS series to critique its storytelling memes. To be fair, as machinima, it is far from unworthy of praise - even if I don’t like the story conceits and characters, the level of detail and visual design/direction is standard-setting. Unfortunately for me, none of this moves me if I have to sit through hours of expository tripe about possessed appendages and sexually confused immortals. Anne Rice does that stuff rather better, thanks.
Take it all with a grain of salt. No matter who says what about any game, people buy it based on their opinions. MGS4 has by any commercial standard started off very successfully, and that will continue even if reviewers bash it completely from this day forward. Fan hype propels it like a Pratt & Whitney turbofan.
Oh and BTW, I can’t speak for Bandit Anthony, but I do have a PS3.
Sup guys,Ive been watching alot of Hiphops shows and have listened to all the Warzone podcase and what not,But you guys was right aboutwhat you said at the beginning,I had no idea their was other podcasters on this site,But I must say I am very pleased to have came across this,and will add that I really enjoyed your podcast,Almost up there with the warzone - the conflicting battle stuff(Which I kinda enjoy sometimes.Also letting ya know you now have a new fan(Man Im gonna be spending alot of time trying to keep up with all these podcast*Warzone,Hiphop and now you guys)
On another note,I am 25yo I have been playing games since I was strong enough to pick up a controller,I myself have played all the MGS 1-3 and I really enjoy them,I have yet to open my MGS 4 yet though as I’m waiting on my regular edition to get here via postal because I decided not to open my Limited copy,But anyways I personally did not hear you guys state or mention anything out of the way toward MGS 4,Ya’ll have your opinions and thats that,No one should bash someone because they state their opinions on a game(Unless they state their opinions as facts in which they have no idea because they have not played it).
But yea again very nice show guys and I look forward to your next one
Feel free to add me on PSN or Xfire(PC) if you want to go at it on a game or 2 (I have probably got it
PSN=Humanbones
Xfire= rochumanbones